August 15, 2007

Approaching Power On

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Word from the factory floor is that power on should happen within the next 10 days.

UPDATE: After speaking with several people in Everett it looks as though power on will not happen in the next 10 days despite a fervent effort to achieve this goal. 500 of 600 tasks still remain before this can occur. There is a general time line for when this could happen, and will provide an update as soon as one becomes available.

33 comments:

Anonymous said...

not going to happen that soon and Im on the factory floor.

Jon said...

who ever just posted that last comment please contact me at flightblogger (at) gmail (dot) com please

Anonymous said...

This site looks to be driven by Boeing. Is that true? Explain your access to photos, etc.

If so, then anonymous of 4:05 ought to be careful about responding to jon's note.

Watching said...

Further, is this a Whole Foods type of thing? Granted, Airbus isn't being trashed. But, if this is a Boeing sponsored site, we ought to know.
How many are in the group of creative writers working here?
Is this a pseudo-technical blog to fill in much needed information that we've wanted for a very long time?

Anonymous said...

Wow... I love some of these comments.. the whole history of this site has been rather transparent if you have followed the author's postings on airliners.net.

Ofcourse it's much easier to toss around accusations with these anonymous tags.

Infact I think I'll tag myself anonymous and call you morons... jack-asses.

Anonymous said...

idiots.....this is not a boeing website, the have better things to do like kicking airbus' butts!

Anonymous said...

I;m actually on the floor too....as a inspector and yes it will be with in the next 10 days!

Anonymous said...

First of all... this is not a Boeing site.

Second of all... Whoever keeps saying power on will be in the next 10 days needs to be smacked around. Don't beleive whoever said they are an inspector also... they are either drunk, high AND a moron, OR... just plain blind. Retards...

This site is losing what used to be credibility.

Jon... i've warned you to VERIFY what your sources tell you before you post it. They have been feeding you a line of crap time in and time out! This one just takes the cake...

HIT said...

Ok, why not accept things at face value and if not TRUE, then complain.

If the site is driven by Boeing, a great share of the negative comments must be Airbus; remember Leahy???

As the Book says, "Let ye without sin cast the first stone..."

Anonymous said...

Definitely won't be that soon.

NIGHT OWL said...

WOW EASY NOW 787 FANS ....
First thing is weather someone is right about power on is right or wrong isn't worth getting mad over.

If it happens in 10 days it proves that somebody "IS" in the know... If not, don't get all worked up over it..... Belive me the 787 will fly when "She" is ready.

For those of you who have the honor of making the "Dream-Liner" a flying reality keep up the good work. Hold your heads high and be proud of what you are accomplishing up there in Everett.

Way to go "Everett Dreamliner Team"

Anonymous said...

If you look at the calandar there are 6 weeks left till October...

Anonymous said...

Jon,

I posted a comment yesterday and you deleted it. Since you apparently didn't agree with my point, I suppose the deletion is your way of saying that all comments are edited and you will only post those that lean in your direction. It's a shame.

Jon said...

To the person who just posted, I deleted no comments. Nor have I ever deleted any (other than spam) in the past. Are you sure it posted properly? I would very much like to hear your comments. Please feel free to post them here.

Thanks,

Jon

64Plus said...

500 of 600 left with no idea of when things will be done. Not an exact quote, but you get the picture.

I posted under another forum that this is an 'earned value' problem and was laughed at. You see, it is a hard problem to know the future.

Who has 20-20 foresight? Yet, Boeing seems to have fallen into this trap and ought to have known better. I'm sure that it was despite counsellings by knowledgeable engineers.

It's easy for people to poke at Boeing, somewhat like the arm chair quarterback. Some of this could be forestalled if the Company were only a little more clear and open about things.

Planning needs to be an incremental discipline with no more than a few major steps planned in detail. Then, as things progress, forward estimates need to be rolled with new insights (I'm sure that the Air Force knows this, to boot). Mind you, that is planning that is not re-doing something already done (has the 787 been done before?).

You don't plan out several years under something entirely new especially when there are major changes across all sorts of horizons, except in some fuzzy sense (where the fuzziness can be limited somewhat). What did we hear recently? Oodles of bucks are being thrown at the problem now (know about the mythical man month, anyone?).

The thing is, though, that with all the horizontal expansions, how many of these type of gotchas (assuming the information is true - we have to trust jon on that) are in the wing.

Perhaps, we ought to have a contest, like guessing the number of beans in a jar.

64Plus said...

Let me put it this way. Ever ride in a car with kids. Are we there yet?

Well, in programs, the engineers are the drivers. The managers are the ones who keep asking (are we there yet?). Or, worse, they categorically say that WE'RE THERE, as if management's imperative overrides reality.

Now, there are engineers who say, ALMOST THERE. Then, they do something that takes them back a few steps (but, hey, this is (ought to be) a learning process). Does anyone know of engineers who try to muddy the waters and keep from finishing?

Earned value isn't the only method, however the problem is to really know where along a series of steps you are (assuming that you know all the steps - well, we got to where there could be a show and tell).

Then, you hope that you have a good mapping from the steps to time, resources, and money. And, that what you do is repeatable (how many things are being done now that is causing Lean & Efficient to pull their collective hairs?).

Ah, not so easy, except for a rat on a treadmill.

Martin said...

I have to agree with the comments made by 64plus. He/she has valid points to take into consideration. If the power isnt going to be turned on within the next 10 days, then that's ok. There ARE going to be delays, Boeing knows this, they planned for this. So whats the big deal? None.

The poster, anonymous, who claims to be on the floor and as an inspector (in my humble opinion, please calm down. Nobody is accusing anybody of anything. We all want to see a great product fly successfully. And we know it will. There shouldn't be any reason why you, Mr. anonymous inspector, should be taking things to personally on this site. But then again, you do have a right to an opinion.

Additionally, I have to commend Jon for keeping this site going. I check this daily. Its great to see the 787 Dreamliner come to life slowly! Shes gonna look so good! :-)

lee_umstattd said...

Jon - I do think some comments have vanished. Of course, this only adds to the intrigue.

Anonymous said...

There are 500 to 600 tasks remaining before the first flight?
Has the number of tasks grown since July?

Scott Hamilton said...

I've found Flightblogger to be a well-informed, useful resource of information. While All Boeing, All the Time, Jon sets himself apart from others with factually-based commentary that sets an impersonal standard others should follow.

While sometimes a little too rah-rah for my taste, I think Jon does a good job.

Anonymous said...

Jon needs to be much more sceptical about Boeing's progress on the 787. It is NOT going per plan. He'd have a stronger following if he pointed out the continuous string of delays and then would dig into the real reasons for these delays.

I read today that a Boeing PR person claimed recently it was typical for first flight to take place 2-3 weeks after first power-on. How can anyone take Boeing seriously when they release such rediculous statements.

Anonymous said...

First thing is this is a just a Blog that Jon was nice enough to start and maintain. Second is this is not an officially sponsored Boeing web site.
The material, thoughts and information gathered here are nothing more that well educated assumptions and guesses based on information gathered through various sources all of which are not official in any sense. The information that Jon provides all of us is at best a good assumption.
I for one feel that the Boeing Executives and Shareholders should be required to read this Blog.

Anonymous said...

#23. That wasn't me who wrote that about the Shareholders and Executives. In fact, as a Shareholder, if they started the rediculous requirement requiring me to read this blog, I would stop reading it.

Anonymous said...

Here a just-issued news story about the 787 delay.

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_generic.jsp?channel=awst&id=news/aw082007p3.xml&headline=Boeing%20Readies%20Backup%20787%20Flight-Test%20Plans

Sorry about the length of the URL---

Anonymous said...

Thanks for the AW link. Boeing is an optimistic company but I think this caused them to seriously underestimate the risks and the consequences of these risks.

And to make matters worse, they are considering adding more risks to solve the existing ones. Ughh.

I fully expect there to be one or more bombshell problems, such as with the composites or software, that will not have a quick or easy fix.

Keep up the good work. I look forward to more reports both pro and con.

Anonymous said...

Perhaps jon could put out a graph with a question. Suggestions?

Is Boeing chewing up some hard-earned goodwill with their mishandling of the 787?

Of the current problems, did Mulally know when he left?

There is time; should Boeing form a 787e project to make this work?

On another note, a question in my mind is how would the 787 handle the crash today? What are the failure modes for the composite? Shatter? Splinter? Melt? Disintegrate? Delaminate? ...

Anonymous said...

I do agree on the fact that time from power on to FF is closer to 3 months than to 3 weeks !
Power on is not like switching on home lights... Do not forget that on top of A/C systems you must integrate and check flight test installation as well...

Do not forget that even working 24/7 you cannot be more than 3 guys within cockpit...

Issue for me is that Boeing has very good engineers but an airplane is no more made by engineers but by managers and planning keepers...

So I do believe that FF should arrive early 08.

Anonymous said...

This is not good news. I wonder how Wall Street will react to this when it hits the WSJ?

They don't take kindly to Boeing ethics problems including lying to investors about being "On track" when it's pretty clear they have been off-track for months.

The Airbus crowd is going to have a field day with this one.

Anonymous said...

"The Airbus crowd is going to have a field day with this one."

I don't think Airbus will gloat over this after the A380 problems. Boeing didn't gloat (at least publicly) over the A380 delays because they knew what happened to them (Boeing) in 1997 and what could happen to the 787. Even in private discussions, the Boeing executives (and certainly the engineers) didn't gloat.

Anonymous said...

Neat site!

FYI: I was invited by a friend of mine to attend the Boeing family day at the Everett plant yesterday, August 19, 2007. When we arrived inside the building we made a mad dash to the other end of the building to see the 787, and what a surprise to see her in pieces. Both engines were off, all the fusalage and cockpit windows are out, nose cone off, tale rudder was off and being worked on down on the floor in front of the aircraft. She is totally surrounded by scafolding.

Anonymous said...

And, now 5 days from power-on?

Anonymous said...

If this is easy then airbus would have done it. When the whole world watches you have to have to do it right. Done right and you can stick a fork in the xwb and call it done.

AdenOne said...

What a sad bunch of people. If you don't have anything nice to say about Jon's site then go create your own 787 site and apply your negativity there. I am sure you will all do much better than he has.